In this episode of Grow Your Credit Union, host Joshua Barclay and co-host Becky Reed welcome Jim Ahrens, Chief Value Officer at PFP Services, to dive deeper into the challenges and strategies behind effective outbound marketing. Picking up from episode 27, this discussion explores why outreach efforts still fall short, how credit unions can shift toward a true service-driven culture, and which metrics actually measure success.
Overcoming Roadblocks to Effective Outreach
Credit unions know that growth depends on proactive outreach, but execution remains a challenge. Jim Ahrens explains that consistency is key—credit unions need structured outbound programs, not just one-off call campaigns.
Becky Reed, reflecting on her experience as a longtime credit union CEO, notes that many credit unions operate reactively rather than proactively. At Lone Star Credit Union, they embraced a philosophy called “Be the doctor”—diagnosing a member’s financial needs before offering solutions. Selling, she argues, isn’t about pushing products but about helping members make informed financial choices based on real needs.
At PFP Services, this led to the creation of MemberConnect, a dedicated outbound department designed to help credit unions engage with members regularly. Trained representatives make daily calls, focusing on positioning the credit union as a financial ally rather than a sales-driven institution.
Joshua adds that the most effective outreach programs shift the mindset from “next best offer” to “next best action.” By focusing on what truly benefits the member rather than what’s easiest to sell, credit unions can build trust and long-term engagement.
Building a Service-Driven Culture
Successful outbound engagement goes beyond training—it requires embedding service into a credit union’s culture. Jim emphasizes that every call should start with understanding the member’s profile, ensuring conversations are relevant and personalized.
Rather than pitching random products, representatives at PFP Services lead with financial wellness insights, identifying ways to save members time and money. The goal is to build relationships, not just drive immediate sales.
Becky highlights that for this approach to work, employees at every level—whether in lending, marketing, or operations—need to embrace a consultative mindset. At Lone Star, the philosophy was “walk the talk”—ensuring that service-driven behavior wasn’t just trained but actively practiced in daily interactions.
Jim shares how ongoing cultural reinforcement is essential. His team regularly shares success stories internally, highlighting real moments where proactive outreach helped members through financial hardships. By reinforcing these moments, credit unions can keep service at the forefront of their operations.
Key Metrics for Outbound Success
Measuring outbound marketing’s success goes beyond basic response rates. Jim explains that while closing rates matter, a truly healthy program tracks multiple key performance indicators.
One essential metric is reach rate—how many members actually answer the phone. At PFP Services, this number typically falls between 30–32 percent. Another critical measure is transfer rate—the percentage of members willing to speak with a credit union representative after the initial call. At PFP Services, that rate reaches 75 percent.
Joshua and Becky note that many credit unions struggle with data analytics, making it difficult to measure outbound ROI. Jim emphasizes that tracking every step of the engagement funnel, from email open rates to final product adoption, allows credit unions to fine-tune their outreach strategy.
Ultimately, outbound engagement isn’t just about immediate sales—it’s about maintaining visibility. A single annual call may not result in an instant transaction, but it ensures that when a member needs financial services, their credit union is the first place they turn.
Top Takeaways from This Episode
- Proactive outbound engagement requires structure and consistency. It’s not about one-off campaigns—it’s about being a reliable financial ally.
- Selling in credit unions should focus on service, not transactions. The best approach is consultative, ensuring members receive solutions tailored to their real needs.
- A strong service culture starts with training but thrives on reinforcement. When employees hear real success stories, they understand the impact of their outreach efforts.
- The best outbound programs measure more than just sales. Reach rate, transfer rate, and engagement tracking help credit unions refine their strategy for long-term success.
- Long-term relationships drive credit union growth. Even when a member isn’t ready for a product today, consistent outreach keeps the credit union top of mind when they do need financial services.
Listen to the full episode to learn how credit unions can build stronger, data-driven outbound strategies while keeping member service at the core of everything they do.
Thanks to our sponsor, PFP Services
Full Transcript
Joshua Barclay: Hey, credit union community! Today, we’re picking up a conversation we started back in episode 27 with James McBride and David Sussman, where we talked about three key drivers of credit union growth: member engagement, cross-selling, and outbound marketing. This time, we’re taking it further. What’s still getting in the way of effective outreach? How can you build a true service-driven culture? And what metrics actually matter when measuring outbound success? Stay tuned and find out.
Welcome to Grow Your Credit Union. This is the podcast where credit union leaders gather, learn, and grow. I am your host, Joshua Barclay, and with me is my lovely co-host—she’s a big Trekkie, she’s the talk of Texas, I could go on and on—Becky Reed. Becky, what’s going on?
Becky Reed: Howdy, y’all!
Joshua Barclay: You know, I was thinking about you because when we were in Phoenix together, you took the Waymo self-driving car, right? You were taking that self-driving taxi. And I had a bunch of flights last week—I was in Detroit, I was in Connecticut—and I thought to myself, “What if there was a Waymo plane?” Would Becky be willing to board a plane with no pilot? Becky, I’m dying to hear your answer on this, because you are like a guinea pig that is willing to test anything. Would you get into an autonomous plane?
Becky Reed: Well, I would say initially no, but honestly, it’s not that much different than a car. So I wouldn’t be opposed.
Joshua Barclay: Any of the providers, if you’re listening, and you want to test your autopilot plane with Becky Reed, contact her on LinkedIn. Okay, Becky, let’s kick into the show.
But before we begin today’s show, I want to first mention our sponsor, PFP Services. Today, we welcome our sponsored guest, the Chief Value Officer at PFP Services, Jim Ahrens. Jim, welcome to Grow Your Credit Union.
Jim Ahrens: Thank you very much, Josh.
Overcoming Roadblocks to Effective Outreach
Joshua Barclay: Credit unions know that growth depends on proactive outreach, but many still struggle to execute it effectively. Jim, from your experience, what are the biggest roadblocks preventing credit unions from being truly proactive in their member engagement?
Jim Ahrens: Well, it’s a difficult task and one that our credit unions talk to us about a lot. Before we had member engagement up and running, we listened to what our credit unions were saying—their desire to make outbound calls to their membership on a consistent and regular basis. So we decided to put our thought process together to solve that problem for them, and that’s how member engagement was born.
The first thing we did was develop a new department at PFP called MemberConnect. MemberConnect’s sole function was to get people trained up and running on the phone, making outbound dials on behalf of our credit unions every single day. Those people needed to be driven and motivated to make those dials. We had to put together incentive plans for them to earn extra money based on their results, listen to the messages they were leaving for members, and make them more and more effective. We also had to control the call volume—how many calls they were actually making every day.
Consistency is key with making outbound phone calls. It is just one phone call—it’s not multiple calls—but we want members to understand that the credit union is here, it’s your lifetime financial ally and partner for the future, and that’s the focus of the phone call.
Becky Reed: I love that phrase, “financial ally.” That’s a great distinction compared to some random spam caller trying to annoy me. I was a CEO for around 30 years, so if anybody knows about the roadblocks that can prevent a credit union from being good at outbound calling or proactive approaches, it’s me. Generally, credit unions are reactive, not proactive.
We had a saying at Lone Star Credit Union: “Be the doctor.” That meant diagnosing a problem and prescribing a solution—not selling. We have lots of different names for it, like “needs-based selling” or “consultative selling,” but “selling” in a credit union can be a four-letter word culturally, because we’re really a service model. You’re not serving if you don’t understand the member’s problem.
Members might call the credit union, having already decided what they want you to do, because they came up with a solution on their own—maybe they just want a thousand-dollar loan for a light bill. Instead of just doing what they ask, you can ask, “Why do you need that?” Maybe they need a line of credit, or maybe a credit card is better. That consultative approach requires a different cultural mindset. Specifically for outbound calling, you definitely need a reason to call. You should have some data that tells you what to approach, rather than picking up the phone and asking if they need an extended warranty.
Building a Service-Driven Culture
Joshua Barclay: Jim, talk to me about how you ensure the conversation is relevant to the member. Are you referencing data, scanning info about the member prior to the call? How do you guarantee that it’s a quality interaction?
Jim Ahrens: We start by examining the member profile that’s in front of us before each call, knowing which products they currently have so we can have an intelligent conversation. It’s definitely a combination of finding out what makes the member tick, but before that, we might mention something the credit union offers that helps them—maybe a financial wellness program, at no cost, which they might not be aware of. Then we pivot into how and why the credit union is there as a benefit and how it might save them money by doing fact finding, a needs analysis, asking questions, even sharing stories. We all know we’re bombarded with financial offers. Members are too, and they sometimes forget that the credit union may offer the same product—often better—so they don’t need to go outside for loans, credit cards, etc.
Joshua Barclay: I love that the conversation doesn’t have to be transactional—you’re giving them what they need, which might not be an extra product. I heard one credit union executive say, “We don’t say ‘next best offer’—we say ‘next best action.’” That’s basically what you’re describing.
Jim Ahrens: Absolutely. A member might not be in the market right now, but hearing from their credit union once a year keeps you front of mind. So if they need something later, they remember, “Oh yeah, the credit union does that.” That yields short-term results and long-term relationship building.
Joshua Barclay: Many credit unions focus on training their teams to cross-sell effectively—and for some folks, “cross-sell” can sound like a dirty word. But training alone doesn’t always translate into action. Jim, from your experience, how much of successful cross-selling is training, and how much is about building a culture where employees naturally help members?
Jim Ahrens: It’s definitely both. I’m old enough to remember when it was all about “features and benefits.” That’s old-school. You have to evolve the conversation and train on how and why the credit union is a benefit, not a push. Back when check cashing booths were on every corner, people lost 10 percent of their paycheck just to cash it. Credit unions changed that. It’s the same with loans or any product—if you’re saving members time, money, or giving them more convenience, you can’t call that selling. You’re solving a problem. That’s how we train now: be solution-oriented for each member.
Becky Reed: Exactly. It’s not sleazy if you’re truly helping. At Lone Star, we tried to embed that culture, not just run a one-time training. We said, “Walk the talk,” so everyone does it daily, whether they’re member-facing or not, because everything you do eventually impacts a member. Even if you’re in accounting, you might help the MSR who has questions about a bounced check or ACH deposit. That consultative approach can pop up anywhere, so we built it into our culture.
Joshua Barclay: Jim, how do you maintain cultural reinforcement so you don’t lose momentum? Do you do training every 90 days?
Jim Ahrens: We have a culture of internal communication. We share stories and wins. For instance, this week, we called a member who’d fallen behind on auto payments because she lost her son in a tragic accident. Our person empathized, offered support, and let her know the credit union is willing to help her work out a plan. That’s not selling—it’s truly providing a service. We share these stories all the time so everyone understands our mission.
Thanks to our sponsor, PFP Services
This episode of Grow Your Credit Union is sponsored by our good friends at PFP Services. For more than 50 years, PFP Services has worked exclusively with credit unions to grow membership, drive loan and deposit product growth, as well as non-interest income to the bottom line for their partners.
That’s why they are announcing their groundbreaking 2025 seminar series: “Access Your Credit Union’s Currency for Organic Growth.” This dynamic seminar—set to take place in select regions across the country—is designed to challenge and transform how credit unions think about their most vital resource: access.
With the evolving landscape of financial services, credit unions must assess and elevate their reach and engagement with members. Whether through physical branches, digital avenues, or over the phone, true value is measured by how effectively you connect with the communities you serve.
In this seminar, industry leaders will guide attendees through an in-depth personal assessment of their credit union’s access points. From broadening your reach to enhancing member experiences, this seminar will empower you with the tools to elevate your credit union’s impact, expand your member reach, and enhance your connection with the communities you serve.
Visit familysecurityplan.com/credit-unions to learn more. The link will also be in the show notes.
Key Metrics for Outbound Success
Joshua Barclay: Outbound marketing is often judged by cost per lead or response rate, but that doesn’t always tell the full story, right, Jim? How should credit unions think about the ROI of outbound engagement, and which key metrics truly determine success?
Jim Ahrens: I neglected to mention earlier that you have to measure everything if you want to improve. From outbound dialing to connecting members back to the credit union, everything is measured. We think the best lead we can provide doesn’t cost the credit union anything, and that’s what we do with our outbound calling.
Sometimes we get solid data: one credit union told us that, of the 68 loan leads they got last month, 33 actually closed. That’s a 48.5 percent closing rate. We’d love more credit unions to share those numbers, because we send thousands of leads a month. It shows great ROI when you see that level of success.
Joshua Barclay: I know you collect a ton of data. Let’s pick a handful of key metrics beyond just close rate that show if the outbound program is healthy.
Jim Ahrens: First is “reach rate.” Out of all the dials—voicemails, attempts—how many members do we actually speak with? For us, it’s about 30 to 32 percent. Then there’s “transfer rate”: how many members say, “Yes, let me talk to someone in lending or deposits”? That’s around 75 percent. Then there’s the actual close rate. We also look at “conversion rate” at a high level: if a credit union sends us 30,000 members, how many ended up with a product?
We watch all of that. If anything’s off, we tweak what we’re doing. Even before we call, we send an email letting members know to expect a call, and we track open rates. So we measure every single step and adjust.
Becky Reed: Without a third party, many credit unions don’t have that level of insight. We’re good at helping members, funding loans, but not at data analytics or ROI on marketing. That’s why a program like yours can be so valuable—because you share the data.
Jim Ahrens: Exactly. We try to provide as much as possible. Every time we pick up the phone to set up an employer group visit, the credit union knows. Every outbound call, they know. Every quarter, we do an overview of all channels. It wasn’t always this way—25 years ago we didn’t have a Business Intelligence department, but now we do. They focus on analytics and performance, helping us and our credit unions get better results.
Closing
Joshua Barclay: That brings us to the end of the show. Jim, I’d like to hear your final thoughts or last plugs.
Jim Ahrens: You know what? Don’t be afraid—go down the road and test it. If you need help, we’re here. Whether you do it yourself or outsource, PFP is here to support you.
Joshua Barclay: Jim, if someone listening wants to reach you personally, what’s the best way?
Jim Ahrens: You can email me at jahrens@pfpservices.com.
Becky Reed: I think what PFP offers is something a lot of smaller credit unions haven’t tried, and it’s probably not going to cost a ton to see if it works. You’ll see the data quickly. Credit unions often don’t do pilots or proof of concept—they jump in or wait too long. If you want to boost member engagement, check out Jim’s program.
Joshua Barclay: And if you want to reach Becky Reed, she’s on LinkedIn. You might also find her at conferences—she’s traveling constantly. I want to thank you, Jim Ahrens, Chief Value Officer at PFP Services, for joining us. Becky, as always, you’re the best co-host in the entire world. And a huge thanks to our sponsor, PFP Services, for providing a data-driven approach to outbound and more.
As Becky said, if it’s working, you’ll see it in the data—so it’s pretty low risk, in my humble opinion. Check out PFP Services if that’s something you’re interested in. A special thanks to all our listeners for supporting Grow Your Credit Union. If you like the show, follow us on LinkedIn, follow us on your podcast player of choice, and share an episode with someone who’d benefit from it.
If you want to be a guest or talk sponsorship opportunities, head to growyourcreditunion.com to learn more. Thank you for listening, and we will see you next time. Take care—bye-bye.
